FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby KazzaMozz » Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:02 pm

Hi Brenton
Love it Hate it
Okay, this will kill it ...
Open a quick-console and type aplay test.wav .... EEEEEEKKKKKK .... Audio Works!
Hmmmm ... type netinfo ... DOUBLE-TRIPPLE-EEEEEEKKKKK ... I have a network!
Open XFE ..... QUADRUPLE EEEEEKKKKK .... I not only sees the 3TB HDD, it knows it is a 3TB HDD, which is more than Windoze does!

This is one of the reasons Linux is worth putting up with. Even though it can be very frustrating it will never be as big a PITA as Windoze!!
Okay, so now I can confirm that FoxyRoxyLinux can and will support 3TB drives out of the box.

And not only that, I bet it's fast too! Even when Windblows can see & support a 3TB I bet it's as slow as a wet week waiting to happen, no matter how fabulous the specs of the machine are. You will be able to report back on this, as I don't have any latest spec builds that aren't 12 months old!! Would be interesting to know (when you get time) how Foxy & Win7 compares with each other. :geek:

I have played a little with exFAT and also added HFS and HFS+ support, and compiled the lasted version of Gparted.
I think I can make this better than this ...

Yep I have absolutely no doubt you can & will (when time & work permits) very impressive. Just keeps getting better!!!

Cheers
Kazza

[edited by JBV 13/nov/12 - to fix quoting]
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby jbv » Tue Nov 13, 2012 9:13 am

Hi Kazza,

I've got to admit, I am really impressed with the work the various Authors have done, and the work the Debian-Live people have done in pulling all together.

I've hit a bit of a cross-roads though. As usual with *nix, it always seems to be one step forward and then two steps back. When you get back to where you were you are a mile in front, but right now, I think I am at the one step forward, two steps back point.

Some Background ... While I have been working on getting all of our AutoMount and DiskPooling working, in the background (for comic relief) I have also been playing with some MultiMedia stuff. When I get this sorted, it will just blow your mind and will position FoxyRoxyLinux as not only the ultimate home/domestic NAS, but also the ultimate home/domestic media player/machine.

To cut a short story medium, all of the multi-media stuff really requires a special build environment and over the last few days, while I've been building various filesystem and low-level disk drivers, I've been using the special build environment I made for the multi-media stuff. Now, while this has worked, and I have proven to myself that I can make it all, I think it is time to break it (being the development environment) up a little bit. To do this properly, I really need to work at a few levels and improve the "basic or core" development/build environment, and then have specific add-ons, one for low-level disk/operating-system type stuff and one for higher level multi-media and/or desktop type stuff.

I really think I need to take this weekend to sort that out. Then I will do the low-level disk stuff which will take quite a bit of testing and I will also need to play with the auto-mount stuff so that all supported filesystems auto-mount/hot-swap etc properly, then I need to finish the disk-pooling (and test the unknown scenarios), then I need to sort the RAID. I'm not sure how long all of this will take, but it may be 2 or 3 weeks (or weekends).


Creating and managing exFAT and HFS/HFS+ (apple) filesystems is a pain from the command line, as are GPT partitions, therefore I really need to get Gparted to provide better support for them all and the only way to do that is to rebuild half of the disk system from scratch using the latest releases, and make sure I keep our scripts and auto-magic stuff updated along the way.

I'm thinking that I won't bother adding support for the following:
lvm2 (a volume manager/pooling), as I intend to do my own thing that I truly believe will be better.
nilfs2 (wtf is nilfs2, I don't know and don't care)
reiserfs and reiser4 (both are dead filesystems)
ufs (see nilfs2)

Along similar lines, I am not planning on adding mdadm (fake/software RAID)
If someone wants this, then they can just apt-get it and install it themselves.

However,I will add some partition repair stuff and other disk/filesystem test/check/repair tools, that I already have sort-a-kinda working. In all, I think this may end up being a very small injection (it will/should be under 20Mb)

Where it is starting to get tough for me, is that I have to many sqf's and on more than one occasion, I have built something and then tried to cut it out only to discover that I made it with the wrong build environment sqf loaded.

It shouldn't take long to get this sorted, I guess part of the reason I'm getting somewhat messed up is that I have been doing a bit of this stuff while also trying to sort/build my main machine and doing 3 other projects at work. So, it's time for me to call a "time-out" to get myself sorted. I hope you all understand.

If anyone has any "must have" disk/filesystem tools they think I should know about and/or include in the disk/filesystem sub-system, then NOW is the time to let me know. I can't promise you that it will be included, but I can tell you that I will at least look at it and see if/how it fits.

Cheers, Brenton
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby KazzaMozz » Tue Nov 13, 2012 10:26 pm

Hi Brenton
If anyone has any "must have" disk/filesystem tools they think I should know about and/or include in the disk/filesystem sub-system, then NOW is the time to let me know. I can't promise you that it will be included, but I can tell you that I will at least look at it and see if/how it fits.


From what I know of < Mondo Rescue > would be a good add-in. I have heard it's pretty good. Works on just about anything. Plus the all important factor:
Mondo is free! It has been published under the GPL v2 (GNU Public License), partly to expose it to thousands of potential beta-testers but mostly as a contribution to the Linux community.


I'm not sure what you are already looking at but I have used < TestDisk > it contains < PhotoRec > which does recover all of the files however it is limited to dumping them in no particular order and without names. It has been useful at times.

Of course there are the standard Linux ones that I think most people have used at one time or another.
< Ddrescue >
< safecopy >
< Fslint >
< Clonezilla >


Anyway just some ideas for you. Hope they are of some use to you ;)

Cheers
Kazza
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby jbv » Sat Nov 17, 2012 9:17 am

Hi Folks,

I've hit a wall, and I need some help with awk.

Please have a look at <this thread>

This is really frustrating and has some serious implications in that any dpkg package/filename that contains a "++" or "--" in it, may not be carried over properly. Which could bring all of my dpkg wizardry (manipulation) to a screaming halt. As you can probably imagine, I have spent a fair amount of time (over 12 straight hours) trying to find an answer to this one ... alas, to no avail. Right now my head is very sore, and I am feeling very dejected.

The saddest part of this is that before starting on this, I had actually thought of a way that we can have dynamically loaded squash files automatically update the dpkg database even if they haven't been injected into FoxyRoxyLinux. I have tested this and I know it works. This is the real answer to having a "noload" sub-system like the build/compile sub-system I have planned that will load and dynamically update the dpkg database only when it is loaded/installed.

If anyone knows someone who really knows awk and similar tools, could they please ask them if they know how to do what I want to do.

I'm about to call it quits for tonight. Tomorrow, I will try to find a forum where I can ask the question.
There must be an answer that will let me use awk and not require me to learn python or some other new scripting language.
I hope some one can help......

Cheers, Brenton
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby jbv » Sun Nov 18, 2012 2:02 am

With some help from saintless, I found a way to climb over the wall, so I'm all sorted now.

I don't quite have my build environment 100% right yet, but we have made another huge breakthrough.
I have found a way that we can keep only the dpkg database changes inside an sqf in a manner that allows for the master dpkg database to be updated (without any user input/interaction) if that specific sqf is loaded at startup.

This gets over a potentially huge hurdle with having a sqf that you only load at certain times.
What it means is that the dpkg database will always be valid and correct.

This has shown me a potential glitch in the script that removes packages from an sqf, although as that has not been released I will sort this prior to releasing it. At the moment, I have the "fix" inside my build environment, so over the next few days, I will verify that the technique works properly there before cutting it into the mainline stuff.

Time to chill for a little while, before returning to the task originally planned to be done this weekend.

Cheers, Brenton
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby jbv » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:49 am

Quick update:

I did manage to get the whole dpkg, and development environment thing sorted.
This is working quite well and will bode us well in the future.
Thankfully this side of things is much cleaner, and I am much more comfortable with it now.

I've downloaded the latest source to things like Gparted, exFAT, HFS+ etc and unfortunately it did not have the desired result. While I get good compiles and they work and everything, I was hoping that this would let us create exFAT filesystems from Gparted. Sadly, that isn't the case as the one setup I saw that had a lot of strong exFAT support was using a "hacked" version of Gparted.

Further research reveals that Gparted will probably never provide full support for exFAT as Micro$haft license it. Therefore, people like RedHat et-al are not providing any support or asking the developers of Gparted to do any more than they currently do, so they aren't. Basically, everyone is scared of being sued.

While my current build of FoxyRoxyLinux will let you create,format,copy exFAT partitions, it will need to be done from the command-line. I'm sort of torn here. Part of me says that there is no need for FoxyRoxyLinux to have a GUI to do that sort of stuff, as you can and probably should do it on a Windoze machine, whereas another part of me says that this is all "just wrong". From here, I could do one of two things. I think I would be within the spirit of the GPL to ask the person who has hacked Gparted what they did, and if I'm not mistaken, they would need to tell me. Or, I could just trudge though the source-code for Gparted and do it myself, or I could take the line of least resistance and do nothing and just leave it as-is.

There are many parts that make me, and each of these parts want to take a different path :lol: such that all 3 are fighting for a win.

As a key and always underlying tenant of this project is to "try to do the right thing", and maintain 100% Debian compatibility...
Do nothing is slightly ahead at the moment.

This then raises another interesting issue. I think I need to learn how to make .deb files so that I can keep our dpkg database up to date and current with any tools/utilities/programs I build where our stuff is ahead of Debian. As this looks like another whole can of worms that I hadn't foreseen, and will require more learning (that I really don't want right now) I'm not sure what to do about this at the moment. Now I know why God invented Alcohol :o

:lol: Cheers, Brenton
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby jbv » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:59 am

Oh, I forgot to mention ... As Mikey$oft no longer provide a basic Email client like Outlook-Express, and I'm a bit of a Neanderthal who prefers a small light-weight Email program to WebMail, I've started to use ThunderBird and I must admit, that it is growing on me. I've spent a whole 15 minutes getting it sort-of running in FoxyRoxyLinux and will play a little more over the next few weeks.

Is there any "general" interest in this?

Should I create a FoxyThunder sqf with an "injection option", and a 99-snap extension that is fit for human consumption or not?

Cheers, Brenton
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby saintless » Mon Nov 19, 2012 6:27 pm

jbv wrote:Is there any "general" interest in this?

Should I create a FoxyThunder sqf with an "injection option", and a 99-snap extension that is fit for human consumption or not?


Hi, Brenton,

I'm sure it will be useful for me sometimes. So I will be grateful for this injection.

Cheers, Toni
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby KazzaMozz » Mon Nov 19, 2012 8:13 pm

Hi Brenton
yeah a lot of people I know like Thunder I sedcond that sounds like a good idea :)
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Re: FoxyRoxy - Current News - DevRel_03 (current)

Postby jbv » Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:51 am

'hokay ... Consider it a background ... stress relief project.
There are few priorities that are sitting a little higher on my list, but this one is a ... definite, can do.

I haven't done any benchmarks or testing against claws-mail which was my first choice, as it is really quite "light". However, as I am now using Thunderbird as my primary Email package on my main machine ...

Right now, it's looking like...
" ThunderBirds are .... GO! "
Image

If anyone else wants claws-mail, which BTW, looks really neat and appears to be more of a OutlookExpress clone that TBird, the install is pretty easy. If you can't just apt-get, I think there is a "deb" package which is no-brainer. FWIW, I have tested claws quite extensively - including some add-on's like task-bar notifications etc, and it works flawlessly. If TBird turns out to be a problem or just plain bad, claws will be our first savior (you just gotta love it when you have a Plan-B that feels good).

Cheers, Brenton
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